Where in the world are the Central Terminal’s lamps?
Some of the most beloved features of the Central Terminal – it’s various art deco lamps – are the most sorely missed by those who come back and see the building today. The CTRC regularly keeps track of artifacts that came from the building, and it’s been known for several years that some of our lamps ended up in a chain of restaurants called the Cafe Deco in Hong Kong. We’ve had several people visit the restaurants and take numerous photos and even measurements of the lamps to help us in their eventual recreation.
Yesterday, the Buffalo News ran an article entitled Scattered pieces of Buffalo near and far exploring, among other items, our lamps.
Cynthia Schwartz went to a mountaintop cafe on the other side of the world and found a piece of Buffalo.
As she looked through her camera lens on the lights that once illuminated the Central Terminal, she was stunned by the size and beauty of the frosted panes in silvery frames.
The staff at Cafe Deco in Hong Kong looked on as Schwartz snapped away.
“They all thought we were just lunatic tourists,” she said.
Since the boom times of the last century, Buffalo’s grand old buildings have been torn down to make way for the new, sometimes just a parking lot. While most demolitions disappear, often to landfills, some of old Buffalo has scattered and resurfaced — near and far.
The new owners of these pieces of old Buffalo say the city’s grandeur transforms their new addresses with soul and beauty — from the Hong Kong cafe to a room in the American Wing of New York City’s Metropolitan Museum of Art; and from a summer retreat in Fort Erie to a new home in Colden built with salvaged pieces.
“It surprises us how often we bump into a piece of Buffalo in some strange corner of the world,” Schwartz said.
February 1st, 2010 at 5:39 pm
Man this was a cool article.
February 1st, 2010 at 5:46 pm
of special note in the artical is the parapragh thats says :
-Until about a year ago, when he got an e-mail from a Central Terminal advocate, Reading thought the Buffalo station was gone. “I feel good and bad about this,” he said of the lights. “I’m not against the idea of returning these.”
-Perhaps, he said, he could donate one and help procure replicas. He commissioned 40 copies from China when he opened two more cafes, in Hong Kong and nearby Macau. Now that a third is in the works, and there are plans for six in the next few years, he will need more of the lights himself.
Well why should he stop w/ the 26″ and 7′ lights? Considering we have blueprints for almost every light in the entry lobby, exit lobby and main concourse, i think we could set him up w/ a chandelier for the dining area’s, some exit lobby lights for behind the bar, maybe some “starburst” flat ceiling lights for the lavatories.
He wants art deco lighting, we can DEFINITELY give him some art deco lighting !
February 1st, 2010 at 5:54 pm
Heck, for that matter Ill blueprint the Concourse clock from top to bottom. Most of the design is incredibly simple and can be broken down into easy to ship boxes.
Reproductions for originals swap program anyone ?
February 2nd, 2010 at 4:54 pm
Looks like CTRC has an opening to approach the guy. I wonder what the reproductions are costing him. From what I know about China I’ll bet not much, I’ll bet it is less than even your material costs Nick. If they feel that reproductions will do just fine you may be able to get several or all of them back in return for certain considerations. Beyond the cost of the new reproductions from China, “good publicity” would seem obvious. Say a sign at the entrance thanking the guy and saying something like “If you like art deco, be sure to check out…” etc. Very interesting development.
February 2nd, 2010 at 6:02 pm
Ive priced chinese material before. In one case, i was wondering what the cost would be to repair the marble walls of the main concourse. Botticino marble slabs from china were no cheaper then botticino marble slabs from italy. In fact, the Italian ones were the better deal in the end.
The real cost of fabricating new light fixtures is time, equipment and electricity. $300 worth of material will make all the mez railing obelisks for above the ticket windows, but $2000 more wont pay for running a shop to fabricate them properly, not even in China.
My plasma cutter is sitting in the equipment cage of the new shop. The reason its sitting there is because its from a chinese company, and its only good for killing metal, its worthless for CUTTING metal. It was $600 new, and i can buy 4 times the machine from an American company for $1200.
February 2nd, 2010 at 7:08 pm
Hmm, well what I am wondering is that if he has two of the 7′ and six of the 26″ lights, and he is willing to use reproductions in his restaurants, would he accept the cost to him for the eight reproductions in exchange for the originals? I know he is saying he is open to donating but I am just thinking of ways to get the ball rolling a bit faster.
February 2nd, 2010 at 7:16 pm
In the past I worked for a radiator wholesaler that was importing radiators from China. One of the bosses told me that the workers in China made .27 per day (I got out of that job quickly because I believe such low wages are unethical) and that the radiators we were selling to car dealers and radiator shops for, say $100 were only costing our company about $10, and most of that was shipping!
February 4th, 2010 at 12:26 am
It kind of makes you wonder about the quality of the steam locomotives that came from China. The JS’s, QJ’s, and SY’s, if not made to exacting standards, the boilers could be nothing more than bombs on wheels. Especially if not properly maintained. The JS on the Boone Scenic in Iowa I guess is still running with no major issues, as is the SY on the Susquehanna. The SY in Kane, Pa. was damaged in a car shop fire of suspicious origin, I don’t know if it has been worked on since or if it is still in limbo since the Kinzua bridge blew down. The jury is still out on the QJ’s. Getting back to the lamps, keep us all posted on any new developments. I mentioned last year during the plaque fund drive that maybe we should start a fund drive to reproduce some of the lamps, maybe a dedicated fund for each type of lamp, and how many of that type of lamp we would need to reproduce. A little bit of math might be required there to figure the costs of reproducing x number of 7 footers, 26 inch skonces, or whatever type of fixture will be given the highest priority to reproduce. Having one of the actual originals on hand will help greatly, and take the guesswork out of detailing components of that particular fixture. Nick, you’re doing a great job with the drawings, and the only thing better is to actually have an original fixture accessible to us close by (as in the immediate Buffalo area)!
February 4th, 2010 at 12:36 am
To add one more thing. Maybe Bobby Mroz can talk to a few people involved in the BOCES metal trades program, and possibly get a few metal trades students involved in the actual fabrication and even assembly of the reproduction lamp fixtures. Something to think about….
February 4th, 2010 at 1:20 am
If i had actual 26″ and 7′ sconces to measure, oh jeez, lol. When i reverse engineer something that i can actually put in my hands, I try to hold a tolerance of .005″ or less on the blueprints. The last set of prints i did for some car parts i need machined were held to within .002 between any 2 bolt holes or machined surfaces.
all my prints for the central terminal lights are done out to 5 decimal places on length and 2 decimal places on angles.
BEAT THAT CHINA !!!!
February 4th, 2010 at 6:43 pm
I like Paul G’s idea of doing a fund drive to reproduce the lights like the plaque. I think it may work because everyone wants to see the art deco features back in the building.
February 4th, 2010 at 9:23 pm
IDK if this is a job for a Boces class. These light fixtures are a tall order for a professional steel fabrication business that has millions worth of equipment under one roof.
Self compounding errors are a serious risk on these lamps. The bases alone need multiple alignment jigs to do all the forming cutting and welding. This is the kind of job that needs a dedicated crew start to finish, multiple pages of blueprints, and MANY MANY notes taken along the way.
If i could get a dedicated steel shop set up @ the terminal for fabbing this stuff, it would have to have a lock on the door so that it wasnt a “public” area of ANY sort. to much layout and order involved for it to be open access to whoever wants to looky loo.
This is why if i had to choose, id start with the chandeliers first. They hang 55 feet up in the air, far enough away that minor mistakes wont be easy to see
February 4th, 2010 at 10:41 pm
Too bad the terminal doesn’t have the power needed to run a full fabrication shop…great idea but any area that big would still have “insulation” problems. And if you do pick a room in the building make sure the lights are built in sections as to avoid a 3 stooges move where you can get them out the door.
I didn’t wanna be the one to say it but Nick did a good job of saying it. These lights were built by professional tradesman who were highly skilled in there craft. Not something you leave up to a bunch of kids/teens who can barely handle a MIG welder. I consider myself a fairly good craftsman but even this would be out of my reach by a long shot.
Do we know anything about the original fabrication shop/company that built these lights? I know the lights that hung under the concourse over Curtiss St. were manufactured by the Benjamin Light Co. I believe they may still be around.
February 4th, 2010 at 11:34 pm
Actually, with the capital improvement projects the BOCES schools are undergoing, they have access to equipment we could only dream of owning. Things like CNC mills and lathes, robotic CNC plasma cutters, even EDM equipment. Put that together with a small group of dedicated students and instructors serious enough to get it right the first time, and every time afterward, those kids would be hopefullly the volunteers of the terminal’s future! A rewarding experience, it is, not only to build it, but to install it and display it proudly on location! That makes for good PR for the schools too! lol!
February 5th, 2010 at 12:10 am
Is this who you mean Nathan:
http://benjaminelectric.com/
It looks like they are more heavy duty electrical than art fabrication, though they may have contracted out the fixtures’ fabrication and just did the wiring, so they may be worth contacting to see if they have anything in their records.
February 5th, 2010 at 12:28 am
fine, someone set it up. ill give them the prints to the starburst light thats between the red caps room and ticket agents office. One light fixture, 6 different pieces, simple to lay out and doesn’t even need a jig.
the rules: Mo warpage. Must measure out square (overall and individual sides). All butt welded pieces are to be flush to each other. No killing it w/ a grinder.
February 5th, 2010 at 1:51 am
Just my opinion, but I don’t think it is a good idea to farm out something like the creation of these lamps to kids. This isn’t just a matter of welding metal pieces together, the person doing the welding will actually be creating a piece of art. Even people who forge art are artists themselves, with extensive training. Let the kids do something that won’t be scrutinized for its aesthetics.
February 8th, 2010 at 10:09 am
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February 8th, 2010 at 8:35 pm
Uh… Nick, before you give out any of your original drawings, you might want to make sure they are protected by copyright, so someone doesn’t try to steal them and make a buck off of them, like Telesco did with most of the original fixtures! This is to protect you, and maybe also the CTRC against possible frivolous litigation from someone coming out of the woodwork saying your original work was theirs. You’ve got too much time and work invested in creating them to put them at risk!
February 9th, 2010 at 9:42 pm
All my cad files are my own intellectual property and shall remain that way. You’ll notice that nothing Ive posted to date has any sort of measurements on them, and all images are simply screen grabs and not images created directly from the cad file.
i make sure that the line drawings i post cant directly be used to create the items they portray w/o the thief having to do a ton of their own figuring. And i also make sure that all my work is saved step by step as new files. i have about a dozen different revisions of the mez obelisks on my computer, there’s 3 or 4 clock faces, i even still have the “fill in the blank” print out i did for the entry / exit lobby lights.
if Joe Blow from East Yohunga wants to try to rip off some of my work (BCT stuff or otherwise) I could nail him to the wall in court. I know what this work is worth, and while i often do it for free, thats my choice.
Which is why if Cafe Deco wants a wider variety of art deco light fixtures for their next restaurant, and they like the other options that were scattered thoughout BCT , i would greatly prefer the idea of us building the lights for them.
But i guess that depends on aalot of different factors, and im putting the “idea cart” in front of the horse